Author Topic: Impeachment popcorn ...  (Read 337 times)

Offline kbvette

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Impeachment popcorn ...
« on: November 09, 2019, 07:47:55 PM »
               
            PBS and CBS will be televising  the Trump impeachment hearings live.My idealogical opposites have been silent so far,possibly they are mesmerized Trumps awesomeness LOL or hiding head in sand?

   https://www.broadcastingcable.com/news/pbs-going-gavel-to-gavel-with-trump-impeachment-hearings
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Offline Yosho

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Re: Impeachment popcorn ...
« Reply #1 on: November 10, 2019, 10:14:02 PM »
Simple question, is there any possibility that the Democrats will find him not guilty?  From even before he took the oath of office, there were calls from House Democrats and their base for Impeachment. This has always been a forgone conclusion just looking for a manufactured excuse.  It's a sham and a coup.  I want all elected officals held accountable, but it's impossible for me to put any trust in this vile process or the motivations of those participating. 
« Last Edit: November 10, 2019, 11:30:25 PM by Yosho »

Offline xenon75

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Re: Impeachment popcorn ...
« Reply #2 on: November 11, 2019, 08:37:46 AM »
Of course he will be found "guilty".  It is astounding to think that if this is the new normal, that the lefties think this won't happen to their president next time?  Super slippery slope and it will only hurt all of us regardless of ideology.  I guess it is not too surprising as it was the democrats who burned the country down when Lincoln freed their slaves.  Probably over due for 1776 part deux or another civil war anyway.  See you on the other side.

Offline WannaTheater

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Re: Impeachment popcorn ...
« Reply #3 on: November 11, 2019, 09:54:30 PM »
Simple question, is there any possibility that the Democrats will find him not guilty?
Probably not.

Simple question #1: If impeached, is there any possibility the GOP-controlled Senate will do anything about it?  My answer.... no chance.  There is no room for truth, no matter what the evidence shows.  Partisan to the death.

Simple question #2: Do you remember Ken Star and Bill Clinton?

And the final simple question: Do you think it is right for ANY POTUS to withhold congress approved financial assistance unless a foreign government provides dirt/negative public statements about his rival?  Forget about trump/left/right/fox/cnn.

The level of hypocrisy on display is amazing.  Take a stroll down memory lane and watch Lindsay Grahams statements about impeachment during the Clinton years.... Check him out now.  Has even made public statements that he wouldn't even look at new evidence because his mind is made up.  Now there is a guy that protects democracy and the law.  But “look over there.... where is the whistleblower...”. Who gives a sh!t.  If someone calls in a tip that a bank is being robbed, and the culprit is apprehended in the act, is the defense going to be “but wait.... who made that phone call.”  Ridiculously laughable.
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Offline xenon75

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Re: Impeachment popcorn ...
« Reply #4 on: November 12, 2019, 09:27:47 AM »


And the final simple question: Do you think it is right for ANY POTUS to withhold congress approved financial assistance unless a foreign government provides dirt/negative public statements about his rival?  Forget about trump/left/right/fox/cnn.




The answer to your final simple question is yes it is acceptable for any POTUS to withhold the financial assistance.  In fact there are three laws on the books relating to this.  2 U.S.C. Section 684, 2 U.S.C. Section 683 and 31 U.S.C. 1512.  Mind you this has been done for decades by virtually all POTUS's in history. 


Offline Don Panetta aka 404

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Re: Impeachment popcorn ...
« Reply #5 on: November 12, 2019, 10:26:44 AM »
Probably not.

Simple question #1: If impeached, is there any possibility the GOP-controlled Senate will do anything about it?  My answer.... no chance.  There is no room for truth, no matter what the evidence shows.  Partisan to the death.

Simple question #2: Do you remember Ken Star and Bill Clinton?

And the final simple question: Do you think it is right for ANY POTUS to withhold congress approved financial assistance unless a foreign government provides dirt/negative public statements about his rival?  Forget about trump/left/right/fox/cnn.

The level of hypocrisy on display is amazing.  Take a stroll down memory lane and watch Lindsay Grahams statements about impeachment during the Clinton years.... Check him out now.  Has even made public statements that he wouldn't even look at new evidence because his mind is made up.  Now there is a guy that protects democracy and the law.  But “look over there.... where is the whistleblower...”. Who gives a sh!t.  If someone calls in a tip that a bank is being robbed, and the culprit is apprehended in the act, is the defense going to be “but wait.... who made that phone call.”  Ridiculously laughable.

- Ken Star allowed Bill Clinton's attorneys at all proceedings. So did the Nixon Impeachment proceedings. Adam Schiff has not.

- Ken Star did not have any secret witnesses. The only public witness to the Ukraine call now claims he attempted to "Correct" the transcript a.k.a. edit transcripts behind the back of white house officials. Adam Schiff has secret witnesses.

- Ken Star did not summarily set ground rules for proceedings that intentionally left out potential evidence, culprits and witnesses before the proceedings even began that would potentially incriminate his party. Including Joe Biden, His son, Ukranian ambassadors in the US, Democrats who knew of the call before impeachment proceedings began etc. Adam Schiff has already claimed that he will not call on key witnesses that Republicans want.

- Ken Star had to contend with the media covering up Clinton's actions. (Newsweek knew of Monica Lewinsky over a year before the scandal and sat on the story that was eventually broken by Druge creating the world's first internet media scandal). Adam Schiff has the left wing media on his side.

If Trump really did try to manipulate all of this then he should be impeached. With that said, i do believe it should make Biden ineligible to run as well as the evidence against him and his son is just as damning.  The most hilarious part of this is that if They don't manage to impeach Trump on time and they do it during or after the election cycle, he could very well see Pence steam-roll over all other candidates and become President. If Trump is impeached during his second term we could very likely see Pence be a 3 term president.

The media doesn't want to talk about this but it's clear that the American People believe the allegations against Joe Biden. He's been bleeding approval numbers ever since this started. Warren has an uphill battle not only as a woman but as someone generally perceived to be unlikable by Republicans and independents. She won't win unless there's some nuclear scandal that fractures the GOP and leaves no other candidates.

Offline Baiter

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Re: Impeachment popcorn ...
« Reply #6 on: November 13, 2019, 12:46:05 AM »
Doesn't anyone else find it hilarious at this point what Bill Clinton was impeached for relative to what's going on with Trump?

From the beginning, impeachment talk about Trump always centered around whether he utilized a foreign country to get power, or to keep power, in return for favors he could return as a result of that power.  While the favors to Russia is still an open question, we have yet another country where he did ask for favors, by his own admission, and within an incomplete transcript.  To call this a sham and a coup is either extremely naive or purposeful ignorance of the facts.

If someone really wanted Trump impeached they would have put him on the stand and asked him, under oath, about his extramarital affairs.  But no one cares about that.... this time around.
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Offline Yosho

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Re: Impeachment popcorn ...
« Reply #7 on: November 13, 2019, 05:23:18 AM »
Not really, no. Bill Clinton was impeached for lying under oath (which he also lost his law license for). The impeachment investigation was started because he abused his power with an intern by having sex with her and then going on tv and directly lying to public about it during a press conference. He and Hillary then went on a coverup press tour until the dress came out and they couldn’t deny it any longer. Add in his history of sexual misconduct including a long history of allegations of rape of subordinates as well as Hillary’s history of covering it up, and the guy is a scumbag and so is she.  Unless you’ve got Trump raping subordinates, lying under oath, and Melania and the press covering it up, I don’t see the equivalentcy.  I wasn’t surprised to hear that Clinton was a frequent visitor to Epstein’s island.  None of that matters to the press and to some of his supporters because he’s a Democrat. Like Clinton said, I guess it all comes down what your definition of “is” is.  The Truth doesn’t matter.

Trump on the other hand is being attacked by Democrats in the House (calling it an investigation would imply they care about the truth) for a phone call that he made asking that corruption and possibly the former Vice President be investigated for apparently abusing his power to interfere in a foreign country to enrich his family. Biden bragged on camera to the very thing that Trump is being accused of by people who’s only evidence against Trump is their impressions and concerns. Should we not want to investigate a Vice President who abused his office by extorting a foreign country for his family’s profit?  What about the 1.5 Billion investment that Biden’s son received from China after he visited with his Dad on Air Force 2?  What promise or suggestion of favors did Hunter Biden or his Dad make to receive that investment?  Is that why Biden is soft on China and says they’re no threat?  Again, some people aren’t interested because we’re talking about Democrats. Who know, a fair investigation may actually clear him of wrong doing, though I doubt it.

If this farce in the House was not part of a concerted effort by Democrats since before he even took the oath of office, by career deep state employees who have close ties to Biden and the Obama administration and think they know best, and by a biased press that has a personal hatred of Trump... and if the Republicans had the same rights to call witnesses that the Democrats had during the Clinton and Nixon impeachments,, then maybe you could call all this legitimate, but since if all those existed, we wouldn’t have this coup in the first place, it’s a non-starter.

We’re in a Cold Civil War. Trump will not be removed as President as the Senate won’t vote to remove him.  The left and Democrats will be upset. Trump will likely win re-election and the left and some Democrats will loose their mind and we may see more violence like we’ve already seen against Trump supporters.  The farce of an investigation and impeachment will give false hope to those who have irrational fears of Trump and who already equate speech with violence.  If i’m wrong, and Trump is successfully removed, his supporters will see it as a successful coup and a subversion of Democracy and the Constitution by authoritarian Communists. That could easily lead to violence as well by his more radical followers. Either way, this circus is dangerous and destabilizing to civil society and I worry for our country during the coming years if this pattern continues.
« Last Edit: November 13, 2019, 05:56:12 AM by Yosho »

Offline Don Panetta aka 404

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Re: Impeachment popcorn ...
« Reply #8 on: November 14, 2019, 10:09:33 PM »
Ukrainian Foreign Minister, Vadym Prystaiko testimony today:

“I have never seen a direct relationship between investigations and security assistance.”

Offline kbvette

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Re: Impeachment popcorn ...
« Reply #9 on: November 15, 2019, 05:49:29 PM »

                              Um, maybe my Trump supporting friends could ya know like cable,call,email ,prayer chain,put pen to letter...….that tweeting
disparaging remarks about a person giving testimony possibly against them is low brow and generally frowned upon
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Offline Yosho

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Re: Impeachment popcorn ...
« Reply #10 on: November 15, 2019, 06:02:32 PM »
Here’s what Trump tweeted that had the Dems and the Press so outraged:

Quote
”Everywhere Marie Yovanovitch went turned bad. She started off in Somalia, how did that go? Then fast forward to Ukraine, where the new Ukrainian President spoke unfavorably about her in my second phone call with him. It is a U.S. President’s absolute right to appoint ambassadors....They call it “serving at the pleasure of the President.” The U.S. now has a very strong and powerful foreign policy, much different than proceeding administrations. It is called, quite simply, America First! With all of that, however, I have done FAR more for Ukraine than O.”

According to the Dems and some of the Press, that’s witness tampering.  You be the judge, but I don’t see how this statement would be any different if it was given during a press conference than through a tweet. I guess I’d you’re the corporate press, you’d be salty that he can bypass you to get his message out, and if your a Democrat Congressman, you’d be looking for anything at this point to escape from the mess you’ve created.

Offline kbvette

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Re: Impeachment popcorn ...
« Reply #11 on: November 15, 2019, 06:23:15 PM »
Here’s what Trump tweeted that had the Dems and the Press so outraged:

According to the Dems and some of the Press, that’s witness tampering.  You be the judge, but I don’t see how this statement would be any different if it was given during a press conference than through a tweet. I guess I’d you’re the corporate press, you’d be salty that he can bypass you to get his message out, and if your a Democrat Congressman, you’d be looking for anything at this point to escape from the mess you’ve created.
  The mess that Trump created full stop.period!
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Offline Baiter

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Re: Impeachment popcorn ...
« Reply #12 on: November 15, 2019, 11:00:00 PM »
Unless you’ve got Trump raping subordinates, lying under oath, and Melania and the press covering it up, I don’t see the equivalentcy.  I wasn’t surprised to hear that Clinton was a frequent visitor to Epstein’s island.  None of that matters to the press and to some of his supporters because he’s a Democrat. Like Clinton said, I guess it all comes down what your definition of “is” is.  The Truth doesn’t matter.

Exactly... there is no equivalency.  One went through an impeachment inquiry for having an extramarital affair while in office, and the other is going through an impeachment inquiry for abuses of power while in office, involving withholding aid to a foreign country used to get them to help him suppress a challenger to his power. 

It's important to note that Clinton was accused of having an extramarital affair with Lewinsky, not of rape as you seem to be hinting at.  While there were 4 other accusers, they weren't part of the impeachment inquiries.  If he just confessed, he wouldn't have been impeached.

Trump has at least 23 accusers of sexual misconduct including rape, sexual assault, sexual harassment and neither he nor Melania confessed to any of them, regardless of the existence of audio proof, paper trails, etc.  There is audio tape of Trump claiming that as a celebrity he's allowed to do that.  It's the same thing, but far worse, except for one detail: it was before he went into office.  And most important... if he confessed to the impeachment charges, he absolutely would be impeached. 

That's the big difference you are overlooking.
« Last Edit: November 15, 2019, 11:02:06 PM by Baiter »
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Offline Baiter

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Re: Impeachment popcorn ...
« Reply #13 on: November 15, 2019, 11:03:36 PM »

The answer to your final simple question is yes it is acceptable for any POTUS to withhold the financial assistance.  In fact there are three laws on the books relating to this.  2 U.S.C. Section 684, 2 U.S.C. Section 683 and 31 U.S.C. 1512.  Mind you this has been done for decades by virtually all POTUS's in history.

Yes it's acceptable, except for the "why"
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Offline Don Panetta aka 404

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Re: Impeachment popcorn ...
« Reply #14 on: November 16, 2019, 07:31:16 AM »
On Trump bribery allegations

“Do you have any information regarding the President of the United States accepting any bribes?”

YOVANOVITCH: No.

“Do you have any information regarding any criminal activity that the President of the United States has been involved with at all?”

YOVANOVITCH: No.

----------
Admitting the Obama White house coached her before her 2016 senate hearing.

“The first time you personally became aware of Burisma was actually when you were being prepared by the Obama State Department for your Senate confirmation hearings [in 2016], and this was in the form of practice questions and answers. This was your deposition and you testified that on this particular practice Q&A with the Obama State Department, it wasn’t just generally about Burisma and corruption, it was specifically about Hunter Biden and Burisma, is that correct?

YOVANOVITCH: Yes, it is.
« Last Edit: November 16, 2019, 10:27:05 AM by Don Panetta aka 404 »