Author Topic: LOTR already broken  (Read 9821 times)

Offline owlnonymous

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LOTR already broken
« on: January 08, 2011, 09:40:21 PM »
Well I just purchased a LOTR, played a few games, and then noticed there were a few lights out. While trying to lift the playfield I think I pinched some wires. The games DMD immediately went dead, all the lights on the playfield started to timely flash, and I started to smell smoke. I turned off the game, looked for the problem, visually checked the fuses, and can't figure out what happened. When trying to turn the game back on it shows the same issues and now a speaker hum is present.

I don't know what do. I could take the game to Jim, or if any of you guys would be willing to come check out the game I would really appreciate it.

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Offline ibis

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Re: LOTR already broken
« Reply #1 on: January 08, 2011, 09:44:53 PM »
When all that happens, it means you destroyed the ring!  J/K....you did something that's for sure.  I do not have any experience with a LOTR.  Someone will chime it, but it sounds like it should be obvious.

Offline Mamushka

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Re: LOTR already broken
« Reply #2 on: January 08, 2011, 10:06:48 PM »
Ughhh, what a crappy way to start a new relationship with a game. Sterns playfields do not open like Williams and are a bit more temperamental. There are a few tricks that I wish I would have shown you when you were here :(

Unfortunately Clay does not have repair guides for modern Sterns so I don't know squat about them (and mine is on loan now so I can't even look at it). Hope someone here can help.
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Offline k7

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Re: LOTR already broken
« Reply #3 on: January 08, 2011, 10:29:43 PM »
visually checking fuses won't really do it for ya. you or someone close by should DMM them to see if they're good.

i forgot which one, but i had a DMD pin that did the same thing (minus smoke) one time when i lifted the playfield.  the DMD shorted out, and the game basically "died". i had toasted 2 fuses in the backbox which happen to "look" fine, but when i hit them with my digital volt meter, they were deadity dead dead. replaced, and i was back up and running. never figured out what caused the issue to start with.

the smell of smoke sucks. the fuses should fail way before anything starts stinking up. good luck. :)
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Offline Mamushka

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Re: LOTR already broken
« Reply #4 on: January 08, 2011, 10:39:18 PM »
Yea I missed that, you need to put a meter on the fuses, you have to either pull them all the way out or at least pop one side out of the clip prior to testing them. Also look for anything obviously burnt and let us know what you find.
Pins: TAF, FG (not the Ah-Haaa one), SM, FH, LOTR. NGG
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Offline khabbi

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Re: LOTR already broken
« Reply #5 on: January 09, 2011, 10:26:32 AM »
wish I could help you out on this one, sucks that this happened the first day you had it!  UGH!  I feel your frustration.  Hope this gets resolved fast for you...
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Offline micksimmonds

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Re: LOTR already broken
« Reply #6 on: January 09, 2011, 10:27:55 AM »
pull the boards and test in another LOTR, that way you will know if its a board issue or something else, might save you some time? and cash ?
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Offline pinballcorpse

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Re: LOTR already broken
« Reply #7 on: January 09, 2011, 11:32:03 AM »
Let's start simple.

You learned lesson one.  In general DO NOT lift the playfield with the game on (Yeah we have all done it before for a quick bulb change, but it is not best) Turn off, lift to a stable position and then turn on.

Keep the game OFF for now since you smelled smoke.

Where did you sense the smoke? Under the playfield or in the backbox?

Look in the back box.  Does anything look burnt or discolored? Does eveything look connected? You may have to take the boards out and look on the back of the boards.

You can check the fuses using a DMM.  Set it on continuity.  Lift one end of the fuse out of the socket to test. Looking at them can be deceiving.  If you don't have a DMM, you can get a cheap one from RS or Harbor Freight.  Every pinball collector should have one for basic testing.  BTW now is a good time to check to see the correct size fuse is there. DO NOT overfuse a circuit.

Look at the back of the DMD, anything look odd on the board/connectors?

After you have inspected the backbox visually, look at the underside of the playfield. This may take a while.

First question-Why do you think you pinched a wire?  Did you feel tension in the wires when lifting the playfield? Did you lower the playfield and catch wires? Or are you just guessing that is what happened?  If any of the above happened, look in those areas first.

Lift the playfield to the vertical position.  Make sure you protect the backbox from the apron hitting it.  Do not force it up. If it feels it is binding or resisiting, look below to see if the wire bundles are snagging on something. The pf should be lifted up and pulled forward until it rests on the lockbar.  Then grab the bars and slowly lift and rotate it upward. You will have to pull the bottom toward you a little-it does not pivot like the B/W games. REMEMBER:  Take the balls out or block the lane so the balls don't go falling all over the place.

Look at all connectors to make sure they are seated and connected.  The entire pf wires to connectors that lead to the backbox.

Look at all of the wires and see if any are broken or "pinched" as you said.

Look to see if any coil wrappers look burned or melted.

Look to see if any of the switch or coil assemblies are touching or grounding against things they shouldn't be.  Maybe when you lifted the playfield you bent an assembly inadvertently.

Start there first.  You could also post on RGP-there are many many people on there who have experience with Sterns.

BTW when you lower the playfield and slide it forward, you can avoid ramming it backwards over that hump by gently pulling down on the underplayfield rails when sliding it. Do this while the rails are resting on the lockdown bar. It should move easier.

If all else fails, ask a local collector to come over and help you.

Good luck, keep us posted.
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Offline Miracleman

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Re: LOTR already broken
« Reply #8 on: January 09, 2011, 09:58:28 PM »
dibs.

Offline owlnonymous

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Re: LOTR already broken
« Reply #9 on: January 09, 2011, 10:19:18 PM »
@pinballcorpse I could not locate the source of the smoke. All the fuses tested fine. I followed all of the wiring and could not find a broken or pinched wire. I inspected under the PF and found no burnt areas. No burn on any of the connectors on the PCBs either. I tried powering up after the inspection and it is showing the same issues, and after a few seconds a coil under the PF goes off. It sounds like it's the left flipper or YUK. On the PCBS, all of the lights light up.

I recorded a video of the game powering on @ LOTR issue

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Offline Miracleman

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Re: LOTR already broken
« Reply #10 on: January 09, 2011, 10:28:13 PM »
When you 'went under the playfield', did you unplug and replug ANY of the connectors?

And what exactly do you mean by "I was trying to lift the playfield and I pinched some wires"?

I know on my Playboy and Sopranos that 'bundle' of wires going from the back/bottom of the pf up into the head always gets in the way and can pull on the backboard and it's wiring if not careful.
« Last Edit: January 09, 2011, 10:31:14 PM by Miracleman »

Offline HammysHangout ( Hammy )

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Re: LOTR already broken
« Reply #11 on: January 09, 2011, 10:51:09 PM »
LED L204 shows the reset state of the I/O Board. If this LED is not lit either the 5v DC is below 4.75v or the
CPU/Sound Board is holding the I/O in reset. If the LED is flashing this means that the watchdog is not being feed
by the CPU/Sound Board and the I/O is oscillating into and out of reset.
If the LED is continuously on the board is
out of reset and communication from the CPU to the lamp matrix is confirmed. Testpoint Blanking is the actual
reset signal on the I/O Board. A low voltage indicates that it is in reset this will turn off all Solenoid (Coil) Drivers,
Flash Lamps, Lamp Matrix Drivers, Auxiliary Outputs and Flipper Outputs. A high voltage indicates that it is out of
reset and normal operation can take place.
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Offline HammysHangout ( Hammy )

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Re: LOTR already broken
« Reply #12 on: January 09, 2011, 10:51:50 PM »
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Offline HammysHangout ( Hammy )

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Re: LOTR already broken
« Reply #13 on: January 09, 2011, 11:36:17 PM »
5v rail not below 4.75
light matrix is being strobed (most likely, as thats what cuases the l204 to blink
cpu board most likely still stuck in reset ?

hard to tell on his video, but all 4 lights are on his cpu board.
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Offline owlnonymous

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Re: LOTR already broken
« Reply #14 on: January 16, 2011, 09:41:54 PM »
Big thanks to Hamster and Mick for coming out to look at the game. Looks like the 68B09E MPU on the CPU board is fried so I'll start by replacing that. If that doesn't work I'll need to try the boards out in a other game, or send them out to be fixed. Just an update.
« Last Edit: January 16, 2011, 10:13:42 PM by owlnonymous »

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